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Posted by Michael on January 12, 2009, 5:43 pm
Thanks Doug for your comments.
I truly appreciate the time and knowledge that people here have offered
me. I am still feeling a little bit of shock about the whole thing. I
foolishly thought I was not going to get type 2. Now I have to go to my
doctor to be officially diagnosed so I can get free test strips. A
benefit I never wanted to earn.
Doug Freyburger wrote:
>>
>>> I know there is
>>> significant carb count in even green leafy vegetables. I just don't know
>>> how it will effect me. I will try because I really liked salads.
>
> It doesn't sound like you understand what a "green leafy vegitable"
> is. My favorite example is cauliflower because it's so easy to find
> cauliflower that's not green and that doesn't have leaves. As with
> so many food categorizations you need to know what it looks like
> on the farm. Consider that the Atkins Induction phase also makes
> a distinction between fresh and aged cheeses where you need to
> know how that cheese was made.
>
> There are two Atkins lists for Induction. One is the 10% carb by
> weight list that contains asparugus, brocolli, cauliflower and so on.
> Those are the green leafy veggies. The other one is the 5% or less
> carb by weight list that contains various types of lettuce, cucumber
> (it's a fruit not a veggie!), radishes and so on.
>
>> I guess it depends on what you consider "significant." I'm looking at
>> a bag of iceberg/romain lettuce right now (there are better choices,
>> but this is what I could get) and there are only about 7g net carbs in
>> the entire 11 ounce bag, which contains about three servings. Three
>> ounces of fresh spinach is only about 1g net carb, which is a *lot* of
>> spinach. There are almost no carbs in salad greens, which is why they
>> are on the Atkins Induction list. So I'm curious to know why you
>> think the carbs would be so high?
>
> If you deduct fiber, even doing the green leafy veggies the
> portions can get large. To get over 50 grams in a day it can
> seem like the portion size of cauliflower to get there is as big
> as your head. But try that with the ones on the salad list
> and the portion sizes to get to 50 really are bigger than your
> head.
>
>> When I'm making up a salad, I don't even include the carb counts for
>> the greens in my calculations, because they are basically
>> insignificant compared to the other things that might go in there,
>> like tomatoes, onions, avocados, cheese, and the dressing.
>
> When staying low I'll make my salad of several types of leaves,
> radishes, cukes, maybe a little hard aged cheese like grated
> parmiagan. Those don't add up much.
>
>> I'm in pretty much the same boat you are. If I keep to induction
>> levels, my BG is very stable and controlled. As my weight goes down,
>> I can successfully tolerate more. I did have a disasterous experiment
>> yesterday -- a >20g dinner spiked me 70 points :-( -- but it had
>> nothing to do with a salad.
>
> I'm still tolerant in the range of 50 in a meal, 100 in a day.
> But type 2 by age 70 does run in my family so I know I should
> start tapering down by the time I hit 60.
>
>> So don't be afraid of the greens. They're a low-carber's best friend.
>> If you don't have a carb counting book -- which I'm sure you must have
>> -- you can also use Fitday.com to find out what the carb counts are in
>> foods.
>
> On the 6 month comment - It does happen to some people who stay
> at Induction levels that they fall out of ketonuria and stop losing
> about
> 6 months in. It's on the extremely long list of why Induction in the
> book is two weeks. Been there, done that, got that teeshirt. And
> even though it's true there also happens to some people that they can
> stay at 20 for years without this happening, the conservative approach
> is to follow the directions. But guess how many type 2 diabetics see
> the six month thing happen? Bingo! The 6 month comment is a troll
> tactic when it doesn't include all sorts of caveats and exceptions,
> but
> it does happen to some.
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